I suspect that many vocational pastors will read what you share and will resonate strongly with it.
andre_y
· 3 years ago
DJ
I wish you the best in your new endeavor. In life, it's just as important to know what you're not called to. Do you think that your initial desire for pastoring was possibly spurred on by a low view of "secular" work? I find many very godly zealous Christians have trouble connecting the dots between their vibrant faith and the marketplace application. It's the reason I started my blog -
Thanks for sharing your thoughts DJ... excellent stuff. All the best going forward...
Ariel
· 3 years ago
All those years of theological training sits in dusty boxes because most people dont ask the questions that got answered in seminary. People ask practical everyday questions about life, for which theological answers undergird a wisdom, perspective, and discernment...Some people call it common sense; and, where in the world do you learn that?
I think this paragraph is really perceptive. As a seminary student, it got me thinking so much that I posted about it: Creative Theology. Only the best education teaches you to think, instead of just reciting theology like it is "information."
All the best to you as you move on.
Terry
· 3 years ago
DJ,
Ever since I met you I sort of wondered what your story was in this regard. Thanks for sharing. I think your calling is perhaps as diverse as your desire to do diverse things. Be encouraged. By the way, I have met people who were stuck in the pastorate. I think there are a lot of people in the ministry and manage it like a dead end job, like having to be a manager at McDonalds. What a shame! I'm glad you did not stick it out just because of expectations from others. On the other hand, I'm sort of in my job right now (30% of the reason) because of the expectations of others. I've heard that most people stay in the job they are in because of skill sets they possess don't allow them to move. God has blessed you with some diverse skills.
djchuang
· 3 years ago
Andre, yes, I'll confess that having a low view of "secular" work was a factor in my desiring to do "sacred" work. That partly comes from my own desires to do things to be accepted with God (as we all do, each with our own way), and it also comes from how preaching/teaching is done by many (most?) preachers and pastors. I think you've heard it as often as I have at missions conferences and such, for us to lay down our personal desires and to value eternal things, to be more active in evangelism and discipleship, etc. I don't recall having heard good and clear teaching about discerning God's personal calling, and how career choices fit into the Kingdom of God.
Ariel, great thoughts about Creative Theology! Many (most?) of our institutions like churches and seminaries are great at prescribing information and content, but developing people who can think for themselves, that's very difficult indeed. But, so much more valuable!
Peter
· 3 years ago
hey dj - long time reader first time caller. I enjoyed reading your post. I've been on a good, steady, model-minority career path for a little over 6 years now, and after about 9 years of mulling over whether or not I should go, I've finally taken the plunge and will be enrolling in seminary next fall. Your post articulates a lot of my fears about making this drastic "career" change. But should I realize later that maybe these perceived desires, affinities, and gifts were for something else, I'll at least be able to say that I don't have any regrets.
Gordon
· 3 years ago
Hey Dj - thanks for your sharing. It's great to hear the experiences of people especially as I start seminary. God will continually use you to reach out to people . . .
Rachelle
· 3 years ago
I love my husband because he is who he is, and he's never faked trying to fit into something he's not. One of the best pieces of advice I got while dating Dj when he was in seminary was "don't marry someone for what he does, but for who he is." Sounds pretty obvious, but there are a lot of people (women) who marry a "godly spiritual man" because he is destined to be in the ministry. The relationship becomes based on "the calling" and the doing as a result. I also have no regrets for going through the pastorate years, and for BOTH of us to emerge on the other side realizing our gifts can be expressed in a broader bandwidth than the vocational pastorate allows. I am proud of Dj for going to the next level.
rudy
· 3 years ago
don't forget me when you are on the next level...
marc
· 3 years ago
Hi DJ,
I for one know that i have a pastoral gift, but I would not say that I persevere more than anyone else. I think pastoring is not so much caring for people, but rather, seeing God's gifts in them and equipping people for the work of the ministry (somewhere in Ephesians 4). Now I obviously cannot say what your gifts are, but I can say that I have really appreciated your blog. It is folks like you who make Christianity seem very real and true.
paul
· 3 years ago
DJ,
Appreciate your honesty in you rpost. Personally, I think the whole "clergy/laity" divide has done more harm than good. I'd be curious as to your reaction to this article by a former pastor:
I'm a first time commenter, but an occasional browser (fan) to your site. Thanks so much for sharing your views. As of right now, God has allowed me to counsel, pray, and preach to others in the marketplace. It is truly inspirational to see others in the work place to know more (desire) about God. I ponder the idea to go to seminary. Although I have taken seminary coursework and I'm deeply involved with my home church, I am still uncertain where God wants to take me. Sometimes I waver about what He wants for my life. After reading this, I've decided to wait on the Lord no matter how long it takes and enjoy the ride. I may not go to seminary. That's really okay.
Also, I'm an Asian American male so it helps to hear about a brother with similar perspective and interests.
God bless you and your ministry wherever God takes it.
Traveler
John Lee
· 3 years ago
dj, this blog made an indelible impression on me. I wrote about my reaction to your blog on my blog. Please visit, and feel free to comment.
I really liked this post b/c it resonates with me. If anything, ministering as a youth pastor, worship pastor, and now teaching/small groups paster has taught me more about my giftings. I can DO any of those things, but what my pastor challenged me to think about was where my passion was. I'd have to say that it is also in networking, but also in worship and leadership (according to Wagner's Finding Your Spiritual Gifts, I'm a shepherd, teacher, and prophet - haha)...
But that's why I'll be stepping down from my ministry at the end of this month - to pursue these passions further. After some evaluation, I've realized that what I'd like to accomplish - uniting and networking the 2nd Gen Church - can really only be done (at this particular time) outside of church ministry and only in a conference type of setting.
I appreciate your honesty. I wish I had read this before I went to seminary. Not because I regret going (I don't regret it, btw), but so that I would have a greater understanding of what was to be expected in ministry. I'm actually not much of a task person, myself - I am more relational, but I guess the difference is that I've always worked greater at building intimacy in a small setting, rather than a large setting. I think that's why leadership (development) has always been one of my strengths. In terms of the tasks... I'm more of an idea person and don't like the tasks as much... especially the tasks of a full-time "senior" pastor. In my last year of seminary, we did practical classes in doing weddings and... funerals... and that's when I realized that maybe I can't do it. Had I read this before, I wouldn't have had to wait 2.5 years to figure that out!
All Comments
I suspect that many vocational pastors will read what you share and will resonate strongly with it.
I wish you the best in your new endeavor. In life, it's just as important to know what you're not called to. Do you think that your initial desire for pastoring was possibly spurred on by a low view of "secular" work? I find many very godly zealous Christians have trouble connecting the dots between their vibrant faith and the marketplace application. It's the reason I started my blog -
www.everysquareinch.blogspot.com
The Lord bless you.
I think this paragraph is really perceptive. As a seminary student, it got me thinking so much that I posted about it: Creative Theology. Only the best education teaches you to think, instead of just reciting theology like it is "information."
All the best to you as you move on.
Ever since I met you I sort of wondered what your story was in this regard. Thanks for sharing. I think your calling is perhaps as diverse as your desire to do diverse things. Be encouraged. By the way, I have met people who were stuck in the pastorate. I think there are a lot of people in the ministry and manage it like a dead end job, like having to be a manager at McDonalds. What a shame! I'm glad you did not stick it out just because of expectations from others. On the other hand, I'm sort of in my job right now (30% of the reason) because of the expectations of others. I've heard that most people stay in the job they are in because of skill sets they possess don't allow them to move. God has blessed you with some diverse skills.
Ariel, great thoughts about Creative Theology! Many (most?) of our institutions like churches and seminaries are great at prescribing information and content, but developing people who can think for themselves, that's very difficult indeed. But, so much more valuable!
I for one know that i have a pastoral gift, but I would not say that I persevere more than anyone else. I think pastoring is not so much caring for people, but rather, seeing God's gifts in them and equipping people for the work of the ministry (somewhere in Ephesians 4). Now I obviously cannot say what your gifts are, but I can say that I have really appreciated your blog. It is folks like you who make Christianity seem very real and true.
Appreciate your honesty in you rpost. Personally, I think the whole "clergy/laity" divide has done more harm than good. I'd be curious as to your reaction to this article by a former pastor:
The Urgent Need For Reformation in Pastoral Ministry
Shalom,
Paul
I'm a first time commenter, but an occasional browser (fan) to your site. Thanks so much for sharing your views. As of right now, God has allowed me to counsel, pray, and preach to others in the marketplace. It is truly inspirational to see others in the work place to know more (desire) about God. I ponder the idea to go to seminary. Although I have taken seminary coursework and I'm deeply involved with my home church, I am still uncertain where God wants to take me. Sometimes I waver about what He wants for my life. After reading this, I've decided to wait on the Lord no matter how long it takes and enjoy the ride. I may not go to seminary. That's really okay.
Also, I'm an Asian American male so it helps to hear about a brother with similar perspective and interests.
God bless you and your ministry wherever God takes it.
Traveler
http://www.xanga.com/thecuttingtruth/549440925/...
I really liked this post b/c it resonates with me. If anything, ministering as a youth pastor, worship pastor, and now teaching/small groups paster has taught me more about my giftings. I can DO any of those things, but what my pastor challenged me to think about was where my passion was. I'd have to say that it is also in networking, but also in worship and leadership (according to Wagner's Finding Your Spiritual Gifts, I'm a shepherd, teacher, and prophet - haha)...
But that's why I'll be stepping down from my ministry at the end of this month - to pursue these passions further. After some evaluation, I've realized that what I'd like to accomplish - uniting and networking the 2nd Gen Church - can really only be done (at this particular time) outside of church ministry and only in a conference type of setting.
I appreciate your honesty. I wish I had read this before I went to seminary. Not because I regret going (I don't regret it, btw), but so that I would have a greater understanding of what was to be expected in ministry. I'm actually not much of a task person, myself - I am more relational, but I guess the difference is that I've always worked greater at building intimacy in a small setting, rather than a large setting. I think that's why leadership (development) has always been one of my strengths. In terms of the tasks... I'm more of an idea person and don't like the tasks as much... especially the tasks of a full-time "senior" pastor. In my last year of seminary, we did practical classes in doing weddings and... funerals... and that's when I realized that maybe I can't do it. Had I read this before, I wouldn't have had to wait 2.5 years to figure that out!
Anyway, THAT's more like a bio, eh?